Jane Schwarz Interview

Hannah Jane Schwarz moved from Hampton Bays, Long Island to New York City in the 1930s. She worked in a traditional career at the Hotel Pennsylvania at 34th Street and 7th Avenue until she retired. She tells of her time during WWII as a switchboard-operator at Hotel Pennsylvania and about how she met her husband there. Duration: 1.2 hours.

Jane Schwarz Interview PDF Transcript

Jane Schwarz

Interviewer: Alex Brudno

Date of Interview: 10/6/2012

Interview with Jane Schwarz

Interviewed by: Alex Brudno

Transcriber: Alex Brudno

[Interview: October 6, 2012]

 

1-00:00:01

Brudno:

Today is Saturday, October 6th, 2012 at 2:41 p.m., and I am with Jane Schwarz, who is a friend of my grandfather’s – Cliff Leatherbury – and who lives just two houses down from the beach house where my family and I visited every year.

 

Would you mind telling your full name, please?

 

1-00:00:35

Schwarz:

I beg your pardon?

 

1-00:00:37

Brudno:

Would you mind telling your full name?

 

1-00:00:39

Schwarz:

My full name?

 

1-00:00:37

Brudno:

Yes.

 

1-00:00:43

Schwarz:

My full name is Hannah Jane Schwarz.

 

1-00:00:46

Brudno:

Hannah Jane Schwarz.

 

1-00:00:49

Schwarz:

Right.  But everybody down here knows me as Jane.

 

1-00:00:52

Brudno:

And when you were born?  May I ask?

 

1-00:01:00

Schwarz:

Where was I born?  I was born in a little town.  It was called Good Ground then, when I was born there.

 

1-00:01:11

Brudno:

Good Ground.

 

1-00:01:12

Schwarz:

But a few years later, it was changed to Hampton Bays.

 

1-00:01:21

Brudno:

Hampton Bays.

 

1-00:01:22

Schwarz:

But it was Good Ground when I was born there.  That’s what it says on my birth certificate.

 

1-00:01:29

Brudno:

Hampton Bays?  Where is that?

 

1-00:01:32

Schwarz:

I beg your pardon?

 

1-00:01:34

Brudno:

Where is it?

 

1-00:01:36

Schwarz:

Where is that?  That is down on Long Island.  You know where Southampton is.  Well, Good Ground was a little suburb of Southampton.  And it’s still a suburb of Southampton.  Because they waited too late to try to change it.

 

1-00:01:59

Brudno:

Did your family live there for generations?

 

1-00:02:09

Schwarz:

I beg your pardon?

 

1-00:02:10

Brudno:

Did your family live there for generations?  Did your family live –?

 

 

 

 

1-00:02:14

Schwarz:

Oh, yes.  My family lived there.  Well, it’s a long time.  I can’t – I don’t think I can tell you exactly.  Good Ground was mostly inhabited by the Indians – the Shinnecock Indians, if that’s important to you.

 

1-00:02:48

Brudno:

Did they used to live there?

 

1-00:02:54

Schwarz:

Yeah.

 

1-00:02:55

Brudno:

Who lived in Hampton when –

 

1-00:03:01

Schwarz:

I’m sorry.  I’m having trouble –

 

1-00:03:02

Brudno:

Who lived in Hampton when you were in town – when you were born – around the time of your birth?

 

1-00:03:11

Schwarz:

Both my parents lived in Good Ground when they met.  And they got married, and they had six children.

 

1-00:03:25

Brudno:

And where were you in that order?

 

1-00:03:32

Schwarz:

I beg your pardon?

 

1-00:03:33

Brudno:

Where were you in that order?  Were you like the third or the fourth child?

 

1-00:03:40

Schwarz:

What time – you want to know what time of day?

 

1-00:03:44

Brudno:

No.  No.  I mean where were you in that order of children?

 

1-00:003:49

Schwarz:

I’m still having –

 

1-00:03:52

Brudno:

Where were you in that order of – like were you the third child or the fifth child?

 

1-00:04:03

Schwarz:

Oh.  Oh.  I was the – I was the fifth child, next to the last.

 

1-00:04:11

Brudno:

What did your parents do for a living?

 

1-00:04:19

Schwarz:

I beg your pardon?

 

1-00:04:21

Brudno:

What did your parents do for a living?

 

1-00:04:23

Schwarz:

My father was a bay man.

 

1-00:04:35

Brudno:

A bay man?

 

1-00:04:36

Schwarz:

A bay man.  You know?  A fish – fishing.  But they grew all their own vegetables.  I guess this is why the Indians called it Good Ground.  Because the ground was very good for planting.

 

1-00:05:03

Brudno:

Okay.

 

1-00:05:06

Schwarz:

Okay?

 

1-00:05:07

Brudno:

Uh-huh.  Yes.  What does a bay man do?

 

1-00:05:14

Schwarz:

What does a bay man do?

 

1-00:05:16

Brudno:

Yes.

 

1-00:05:17

Schwarz:

Well, all my father did was just bring in clams and oysters and crabs.  And when I was a child, I learned how to pick crabs.  And I’ve been picking crabs ever since – when I could get any.

 

[Laughter]

 

1-00:05:37

Brudno:

Really?  Uh-huh.

 

1-00:05:38

Schwarz:

I have a friend up the road that supplies me with crabs.

 

1-00:05:41

Brudno:

Really?

 

1-00:05:42

Schwarz:

John Chubb.  I don’t know if you know John.

 

1-00:05:45

Brudno:

No.

 

1-00:05:47

Schwarz:

Yeah.  You don’t know him.

 

1-00:05:48

Brudno:

And what was your mother?

 

1-00:05:52

Schwarz:

I beg your pardon?

 

 

 

1-00:05:54

Brudno:

What about your – what did your mother do?

 

1-00:05:56

Schwarz:

Well, my mother – my mother had a brother.  And the two of them-pause-were put in a home, more or less.  Because their parents died when they were both very young.

 

1-00:06:26

Brudno:

Uh-huh.  Perfect.  But – so are you saying they run a orphanage?  Or?

 

1-00:06:34

Schwarz:

We were orphans.

 

1-00:06:36

Brudno:

Oh.

 

1-00:06:37

Schwarz:

I mean –

 

1-00:06:38

Brudno:

Your parents were orphans?

 

1-00:06:39

Schwarz:

I was not an orphan, but I mean my parents were.

 

1-00:06:41

Brudno:

Your mother was.

 

1-00:06:42

Schwarz:

My parents were orphans.

 

1-00:06:43

Brudno:

Did she have any jobs?

 

1-00:06:48

Schwarz:

My mother?

 

 

 

1-00:06:50

Brudno:

Yes.

 

1-00:06:51

Schwarz:

They both worked for the people that took care of them.  And my mother, I guess, did housework and anything that the people that they lived with wanted them to do.  But – I lost my train of thought.

 

1-00:07:26

Brudno:

That’s okay.  That’s alright.  What was family life like, when –?

 

1-00:07:30

Schwarz:

What did the bay man do?

 

1-00:07:31

Brudno:

No.  No.  What was family life like –?

 

1-00:07:36

Schwarz:

What was family life?

 

1-00:07:37

Brudno:

Yes.  Was like when you were young, when you were growing up?

 

1-00:07:40

Schwarz:

Well, my parents were very poor.  And like I said, they raised their own vegetables.  It was some years later, my mother inherited some money from a brother that died.  Like I said, there were only the two – the two children.

 

1-00:08:17

Brudno:

Yes.

 

1-00:08:19

Schwarz:

My mother’s – I’m struggling now to remember.

 

1-00:08:35

Brudno:

And you said you got money from your brother and –

 

 

 

1-00:08:40

Schwarz:

Yeah.  And she inherited money.  And she started a store – a little confectionary store, where she sold bread and soda and ice cream and candy.  And I – my sister and I grew up – I didn’t remember my two oldest sisters right away.

 

But in later years, I became very close to the second born girl.  And I lived with her a good part of the time.

 

1-00:09:29

Brudno:

And about the – and when your mother set up this confectionary shop – this was when you were growing up?  Or this was when –?

 

1-00:09:42

Schwarz:

I was just a baby.

 

1-00:09:45

Brudno:

So she established the confectionary shop when you were –?

 

1-00:09:48

Schwarz:

Yeah.  I remember running – getting away from my sisters, and running from the house to the store naked.  And they told me this story.  And here my mother was conducting business, and there’s a naked kid running around the store.

 

[Laughter]

 

So I was walking.

 

[Laughter]

 

 

1-00:10:18

Brudno:

Is there any reason why did you –?

 

1-00:10:25

Schwarz:

I beg your pardon?

 

1-00:10:26

Brudno:

Is there a reason why you ran away in the –?

 

 

 

1-00:10:31

Brudno:

You ran around in the nude – any rhyme or reason?

 

1-00:10:36

Schwarz:

I ran around naked in the store until my sister caught up with me and took me back to the house again.

 

1-00:10:45

Brudno:

But was there any rhyme or reason?  Why did you run around –?

 

1-00:10:50

Schwarz:

Huh?

 

1-00:10:51

Brudno:

Never mind.  Never mind.  What kinds of hardships did you and your family face when you were growing up?

 

1-00:11:01

Schwarz:

What did they –?

 

1-00:11:02

Brudno:

What kinds of hardships did you and your family –?

 

1-00:11:06

Schwarz:

Speak up, kindly.

 

1-00:11:07

Brudno:

What hardships did you and your family face when you were growing up?

 

1-00:11:11

Schwarz:

What did they?

 

1-00:11:13

Brudno:

What hardships?

 

1-00:11:15

Schwarz:

What type?

 

 

1-00:11:16

Brudno:

What hardships?

 

1-00:11:18

Schwarz:

What hardship?

 

1-00:11:20

Brudno:

Did you and your family face when you were growing up?

 

1-00:11:23

Schwarz:

I don’t think we considered it hardship.  You know?  My parents knew nothing about the better side of life because they was taken care of from the time they was children.

 

1-00:11:44

Brudno:

Uh-huh.  Alright.  So you didn’t consider yourself –?

 

1-00:11:57

Schwarz:

I beg –

 

1-00:11:59

Brudno:

You didn’t consider yourself being poor – you and your family being poor?

 

1-00:12:04

Schwarz:

My family?

 

1-00:12:06

Brudno:

Yes.  You didn’t – you and your family considered yourself – never considered yourself?

 

1-00:12:11

Schwarz:

Poor.

 

1-00:12:12

Brudno:

Yes.

 

1-00:12:13

Schwarz:

Yes.  We was poor.

 

 

 

1-00:12:16

Brudno:

But you never suffered any hardships or –?

 

1-00:12:19

Schwarz:

No.  We didn’t know any better, so we thought that was life.  You know?

 

[Laughter]

 

1-00:12:32

Brudno:

Yes.  If you don’t mind, I’ll change the topic a little bit.  How old were you when you started school?

 

1-00:12:39

Schwarz:

How old was I when I started school?  Alright.  That, I remember.  I had to take care of my younger sister, which I didn’t care much about.  In fact, I couldn’t wait until I started school.

 

Well, when I was six years old, the only school we had was other parents teaching us.  Because there was no school in Good Ground.

 

1-00:13:21

Brudno:

And –?  As you were saying –?

 

1-00:13:33

Schwarz:

I need to get my breath.

 

1-00:13:36

Brudno:

I’m sorry.  What schools did you attend?

 

1-00:13:39

Schwarz:

I beg your pardon?

 

1-00:13:41

Brudno:

Were there any other schools in Long Island?

 

1-00:13:45

Schwarz:

Oh, yes.  There was a school in the town of Southampton.  And like I said before, Hampton Bays was a little suburb of Southampton.  In fact, my son, who lives in Hampton Bays, formerly Good Ground – he still has to pay taxes to Southampton.

 

1-00:14:12

Brudno:

Uh-huh.  Really?  And, of course, did you attend any other –?  Besides other parents teaching you and the other children, were there any other – did you attend any other schools?  Or –?

 

1-00:14:30

Schwarz:

I just went as far as the eighth grade, and then I got a job.

 

1-00:14:39

Brudno:

May I ask – why were you unable to attend high school?

 

1-00:14:49

Schwarz:

I’m sorry?

 

1-00:14:50

Brudno:

Why were you unable to attend high school?

 

1-00:14:54

Schwarz:

Southampton is about ten miles from Hampton Bays, formerly Good Ground.  And you had to take – there weren’t any cars at that time.  My parents could only afford to send one girl to – on the train to Southampton.

 

1-00:15:24

Brudno:

Hmm.  And that’s why you – so you went to work?

 

1-00:15:32

Schwarz:

And so I just went to the eighth grade in Good Ground, and then I left school and went to work.  I worked at a piano studio.

 

1-00:15:50

Brudno:

And what was the name of the piano -?

 

1-00:15:54

Schwarz:

I beg your pardon?

 

1-00:15:55

Brudno:

What was the name of the piano store?

 

 

1-00:15:57

Schwarz:

Oh.  Hornbeck and Sons was the name of the piano store.  That I remember very well.

 

1-00:16:06

Brudno:

Where was this piano store?

 

1-00:16:12

Schwarz:

It was in Good Ground.

 

1-00:16:14

Brudno:

And how long did you stay in that job – in that piano store?

 

1-00:16:26

Schwarz:

How long did I work at the piano store?  I can’t remember the number of years.  But when I left – I stopped working at the piano store – I worked at Canoe Place Inn.  That was the – quite a famous nightclub.

 

And I got – in the day – daytime – I worked in the office.  And at night, I walked around this big ballroom as a cigarette girl.  Sold cigars and cigarettes.

 

1-00:17:25

Brudno:

Uh-huh.  Do you mind if we go back to the –?

 

1-00:17:34

Schwarz:

I’m sorry?

 

1-00:17:35

Brudno:

Do you mind if we go back to the piano store a little bit?

 

1-00:17:39

Schwarz:

Oh, yeah.

 

1-00:17:40

Brudno:

What was your position in the piano store?

 

1-00:17:43

Schwarz:

I kept books.  And the owner of this piano store – he was out during the day tuning pianos.  And so if people came in and were interested in a piano, I took their name.  They might want – some of them wanted to try out different pianos.

 

And I ordered all the sheet music.  I was very good at ordering all the sheet music because I knew all the popular songs then.

 

1-00:18:30

Brudno:

And those were your responsibilities when you were at the piano store?

 

1-00:18:41

Schwarz:

That was my – my –

 

1-00:18:42

Brudno:

Your responsibilities?

 

1-00:18:44

Schwarz:

My responsibilities.

 

1-00:18:45

Brudno:

Yes.

 

1-00:18:46

Schwarz:

Mainly was to keep the books.  And some people rented pianos.  Some people wanted to buy pianos.  And so I would send them bills.

 

1-00:19:01

Brudno:

Uh-huh.  May I ask?  Why did you leave your job at the piano store?

 

1-00:19:14

Schwarz:

What –?

 

1-00:19:15

Brudno:

Why did you leave?

 

1-00:19:17

Schwarz:

Why did I leave?

 

1-00:19:18

Brudno:

Yes.  The piano store – your job at the piano store.

 

 

 

1-00:19:22

Schwarz:

I don’t think he needed me that much.  And so, like I said, I went to Canoe Place Inn, and I worked there.

 

1-00:19:34

Brudno:

You mentioned earlier – you said you worked in that nightclub called Canoe Place Inn.

 

1-00:19:46

Schwarz:

Yeah.  That was a nightclub.

 

1-00:19:47

Brudno:

Why did you leave that job at the nightclub?

 

1-00:19:55

Schwarz:

Oh.  The man – the owner of the nightclub – he only needed me on weekends.  And his business wasn’t all that good.  And so he asked one of his customers, who happened to be the – she was the chief operator at the Hotel Pennsylvania.  And this is the reason why –

 

In fact, he drove me from Good Ground to New York, and I met this chief operator.  And she gave me a job.  But not as an operator.  I learned that from the ground up, and I’d been very good at my job.

 

And so I did a lot of things there.  I operated a telautograph machine, a teletype machine.  Somehow, I learned as I went along, and she gave me the opportunity to do that.

 

1-00:21:52

Brudno:

If you don’t mind if I go back to the nightclub for a little bit – but you said business was not good.  When you said it was not good, does that mean the business was not running well?  It was not making any money?  Or was the business failing?

 

1-00:22:17

Schwarz:

Well, like I said, this man – he really didn’t need a cigarette girl in the evenings.  And so it was him that asked Daisy Shore – I remember her name – from the Hotel Pennsylvania to give me a job.  And so he drove me there.

 

And so Daisy Shore did give me an opportunity to learn, and I did.  And I can’t tell you how many years I worked there.  Because it was a good many years.

 

And here’s where Albert comes into the picture.  Albert was already working there.  The owner of the hotel – every year, he gave a dance in the ballroom on the roof – in the roof garden for the employees.  And so that’s when I met Albert.  We started dating.  Then we were married.

 

1-00:24:04

Brudno:

What was Albert doing during – what was Albert doing at the Hotel Pennsylvania?

 

1-00:24:12

Schwarz:

He worked as – well, I guess they called them a bellhop in that day.  But he was actually in charge of the bellhops – other bellhops.

 

1-00:24:26

Brudno:

Yeah.  If you don’t mind if I ask about Albert a little bit –?

 

1-00:24:33

Schwarz:

I’m sorry?  I didn’t hear.

 

1-00:24:35

Brudno:

Do you mind if I ask about Albert a little bit?

 

1-00:24:37

Schwarz:

You want to find out more about Albert?

 

1-00:24:40

Brudno:

A little bit.  How old was Albert when you and Al first met?

 

1-00:24:46

Schwarz:

When we first met?  In the thirties.  I can’t tell you exactly.  But it was in the 1930s.  That’s when I arrived there.  But he was already working there.

 

1-00:25:00

Brudno:

Where was Al originally from?

 

1-00:25:08

Schwarz:

I beg your pardon?

 

1-00:25:09

Brudno:

Where was Al originally from?

 

1-00:25:11

Schwarz:

He was born and raised in Maspeth, Long Island.  That’s not too far out of New York City.

 

 

1-00:25:24

Brudno:

May I ask?  What did the two of you have in common?

 

1-00:25:31

Schwarz:

I beg your pardon?

 

1-00:25:32

Brudno:

What did the two of you have in common?

 

1-00:25:35

Schwarz:

What did we have in common?  I can’t think of – other than that we both worked at the Hotel Pennsylvania, we didn’t have anything in common.  But we did start dating.

 

And a few years later, we got married.  We both went back to work at the hotel, until the war started.  And this book is going to tell you a lot about – even thought it’s falling apart.  You see?

 

1-00:26:23

Brudno:

Uh-huh.  May I ask?  How did the relationship –?

 

1-00:26:28

Schwarz:

Huh?

 

1-00:26:29

Brudno:

How did the relationship – this relationship with Al develop?

 

 

1-00:26:32

Schwarz:

Hmm.

 

1-00:26:35

Brudno:

The relationship?

 

1-00:26:36

Schwarz:

We just liked each other – and dating ever since the dance on the roof.  And we went out to different parties together.  Then I went to Maspeth, and I met his mother and father and the brother and sisters.

 

1-00:27:11

Brudno:

And so Al was Catholic?  So Al was Catholic?

 

1-00:27:19

Schwarz:

Was he Catholic?

 

1-00:27:21

Brudno:

Yes.

 

1-00:27:22

Schwarz:

His religion?  He was Lutheran.

 

1-00:27:28

Brudno:

Oh.  Lu – my – sorry.  Yeah.

 

1-00:27:31

Schwarz:

Yeah.

 

1-00:27:32

Brudno:

You said Mass.  I’m sorry.  Forgive me.  I’m sorry about that.  What kind of courtship did you and Al have?

 

1-00:27:45

Schwarz:

What?

 

1-00:27:46

Brudno:

What kind of courtship did you and Al have?

 

1-00:27:50

Schwarz:

What kind of courtship?

 

1-00:27:51

Brudno:

Yes.

 

1-00:27:52

Schwarz:

We went together, I guess, about four years before the war started.  And then we got married, and we just had a four-day honeymoon in Bear Mountain.  I don’t know if you’ve ever heard of Bear Mountain.  But that’s, more or less, a little suburb of New York City.

 

1-00:28:33

Brudno:

Alright.  Do you mind if I change the subject a little bit to –?

 

[Interview Interruption while batteries are changed.]

 

2-00:00:01

Brudno:

Okay.  Before we had our break – brief break – I was going to talk about your work at the Hotel Pennsylvania.

 

2-00:00:13

Schwarz:

My work at the Hotel Pennsylvania?

 

2-00:00:16

Brudno:

Yeah.  Would you mind telling me –?

 

2-00:00:18

Schwarz:

I didn’t know anything about operating – being a telephone operator – except the little bit that I did at Canoe Place Inn.  But that wasn’t anything compared to this 18-position switchboard, which was the largest in the world at the time.

 

2-00:00:48

Brudno:

Really?

 

2-00:00:49

Schwarz:

So I started working for Miss Daisy Shore at about 37 cents an hour as an operator.  But I wasn’t an operator yet.

 

[Laughter]

 

I operated a telautograph machine, and I typed messages to the guests – that people would call in and leave messages with certain people.  And I would type these messages.  And I worked the telautograph machine.  I also worked at the – I’m fishing for words.

 

2-00:01:57

Brudno:

Working for the switchboards?

 

2-00:02:03

Schwarz:

Switchboards?

 

2-00:02:04

Brudno:

Yes.  Did you do the –?

 

2-00:00:06

Schwarz:

You know what multiple is, of course.  This was a multiple switchboard.  And so in due time, I learned how to be a telephone operator, and I was very good at it.  So then I would choose the hours that I could work, and I worked.

 

2-00:02:35

Brudno:

Uh-huh.  May I ask, if you know, where was the Hotel Pennsylvania?

 

2-00:02:44

Schwarz:

Where was it?

 

2-00:02:45

Brudno:

Yes.

 

2-00:02:46

Schwarz:

34th Street and 7th Avenue.  And it’s still there.  But the last that I heard was – people that were showing their dogs at the dog show – they stayed there.  So it tells me that the hotel ran down a lot.

 

2-00:03:19

Brudno:

Hmm.  You don’t mind if I – may I ask you, of course, about your work at the Hotel Pennsylvania?  Did you go through any special training to become an –?

 

2-00:03:44

Schwarz:

I didn’t have any training.  I taught myself.

 

2-00:03:51

Brudno:

How do you teach yourself to become a telephone operator?

 

2-00:04:01

Schwarz:

I’m sorry.

 

2-00:04:02

Brudno:

How do you teach yourself to become a telephone operator?

 

2-00:04:05

Schwarz:

How did I –?

 

2-00:04:07

Brudno:

How did you taught yourself?

 

2-00:04:12

[Inaudible]

 

Brudno:

How did you taught yourself?  How did you teach yourself to –?

 

2-00:04:15

Schwarz:

How did I?

 

2-00:04:017

Brudno:

How did you teach yourself?

 

2-00:04:19

Schwarz:

How did I teach myself?

 

2-00:04:21

Brudno:

Yeah.

 

2-00:04:22

Schwarz:

I watched the other girls. And, like I said, I picked up the tickets. The guests, of course, had to pay for all their local calls and long distance calls. And so when I wasn’t doing something else, I was at the switchboard answering some of the calls.

 

2-00:05:02

Brudno:

May I ask?  When you were working there, what kind of hotel was the Hotel Pennsylvania?

 

 

2-00:05:13

Schwarz:

It was a very popular hotel.  In fact, while I still worked there, the Statler Hilton took over the hotel – bought it and took it over.

 

2-00:05:30

Brudno:

Uh-huh.

 

2-00:05:38

Schwarz:

And it was still popular, even when I left – when Albert – I said Albert and I kept getting closer.  And so we were married.  I guess I’d say we had about a four-year courtship.  We were married, and then he was drafted.

 

2-00:06:17

Brudno:

Uh-huh.

 

2-00:06:20

Schwarz:

And that’s when this story comes in.

 

2-00:06:23

Brudno:

By the way – don’t mind if I have to go back to the hotel – your work at the Hotel Pennsylvania.  But don’t mind if I go back to the topic – to the Hotel Pennsylvania?  Who were the typical guests at the hotel?

 

2-00:06:42

Schwarz:

Who were the –?

 

2-00:06:44

Brudno:

Typical guests.

 

2-00:06:45

Schwarz:

The typical guests?

 

2-00:06:47

Brudno:

Yes.

 

2-00:06:48

Schwarz:

Well, they had different – I’m fishing for the word here – conventions – kind of conventions.  Their biggest business was conventions.

 

2-00:07:12

Brudno:

And what kind of conventions then usually used the Hotel Pennsylvania?  Were they like big business conventions?  Were they like little business conventions?  Were they like hobbies – people who were hobbyists?  Or were there any global conventions?  I’m sorry.  I just –

 

 

2-00:07:35

Schwarz:

Well, I remember there was the Catholic – there were the priests and the nuns – had a convention there.  The different guests who would be coming there.

 

2-00:08:10

Brudno:

And where did you live while you were working at the –?

 

2-00:08:10

Schwarz:

Where did I –?

 

2-00:08:16

Brudno:

Where did – where did – yeah.  Where did you live while you were working for the Hotel Pennsyl –?

 

2-00:08:21

Schwarz:

Where did I live?

 

2-00:08:22

Brudno:

Uh-huh.

 

2-00:08:23

Schwarz:

Oh.  I lived – let me see. [Pause]  Oh, I lived in a –

 

2-00:08:42

Brudno:

Did you live like in an apartment?  Did you rent it?

 

2-00:08:56

Schwarz:

We moved around to different places.  The first place I lived was within walking distance of the hotel.  Because, after all, 37 cents an hour doesn’t buy you very much.

 

2-00:09:14

Brudno:

And what was your typical workday like, when you were working at the – what was your typical workday like?

 

2-00:09:33

Schwarz:

My typical workday?

 

 

 

2-00:09:36

Brudno:

Uh-huh.

 

2-00:09:37

Schwarz:

Well, before I learned to be a telephone operator, I picked up the tickets at each – from each operator.

 

[Pause]

 

2-00:10:15

Brudno:

Alright.  May I ask?  What was your work environment like?

 

2-00:10:19

Schwarz:

Say what?

 

2-00:10:20

Brudno:

Where was your work environment like?

 

2-00:10:22

Schwarz:

My work assignment?

 

2-00:10:24

Brudno:

Your work environment like?

 

2-00:10:27

Schwarz:

My work environment?

 

2-00:10:28

Brudno:

Yes.  Where was the switchboard?

 

2-00:10:30

Schwarz:

Oh, the switchboard was on the second mezzanine of the hotel.

 

2-00:10:38

Brudno:

Second mezzanine?

 

2-00:10:40

Schwarz:

Well, it’s called the second mezzanine.  The hotel was very busy at that time – as I said, with various conventions.  And then, of course, there would be the regular guests.

 

2-00:11:02

Brudno:

I’m just – when you say mezzanine, do you mean like second floor?  Or?

 

2-00:11:19

Schwarz:

The second floor?

 

2-00:11:22

Brudno:

You said the second mezzanine.

 

2-00:11:25

Schwarz:

Oh, second mezzanine.  I used to – one place I lived at brought me into Penn Station.  You’ve heard of Penn Station?

 

2-00:11:38

Brudno:

Uh-huh.

 

2-00:11:39

Schwarz:

And so I would walk into the lobby of the hotel, and I would walk up one flight of stairs.  That was the first mezzanine.  Then I would walk up another flight of stairs, and I was on the second mezzanine.

 

2-00:12:07

Brudno:

Okay.

 

2-00:12:08

Schwarz:

And then right into the telecom room.

 

2-00:12:13

Brudno:

Alright.  You don’t mind if I change the subject a little bit?  How did you interact with your coworkers on the job?

 

2-00:12:26

Schwarz:

My coworkers?

 

2-00:12:29

Brudno:

Yes. On the job.

 

 

2-00:12:31

Schwarz:

Some I was very friendly with; and then others, not that friendly.  But we had – everybody got along.

 

2-00:12:44

Brudno:

And tell me about those that you were very friendly with.

 

2-00:12:50

Schwarz:

The what?

 

2-00:12:52

Brudno:

Tell me about your relationship with those – with your coworkers that you were very friendly with?

 

2-00:12:56

Schwarz:

Well, it was very friendly.

 

[Pause]

 

2-00:13:07

Brudno:

What do you remember about your relationships with the people you –?

 

2-00:13:11

Schwarz:

Now I know I have to go back to a little business that I started.  I was very good at making costume jewelry.  In fact, I’m still wearing some of that costume jewelry.  And so some of these operators was interested in buying this costume jewelry. So I did have this little business on the side.  And then I made a little money selling them the jewelry.

 

2-00:13:58

Brudno:

And this was while you were at the Hotel Pennsylvania?

 

2-00:14:01

Schwarz:

While I was at the Hotel Pennsylvania.

 

2-00:14:03

Brudno:

How did you interact with the workers during your free time – like lunch breaks or after work?

 

 

 

2-00:14:20

Schwarz:

Well, when I left the hotel, I was rather friendly with everybody.  But Albert and I moved from this little apartment that I had all during the war, which was in walking distance of the hotel.  And so we moved out to Whitestone, Queens, and we lived there until we both was going to retire.

 

And we moved – we went to Florida first to look that over as a possible retirement place.  We decided that was too hot and buggy.

 

2-00:15:25

Brudno:

Uh-huh.

 

2-00:15:26

Schwarz:

And so on the way home, we spent a few days in Capeville.  You know where Capeville is?  It’s a little bit south of Cape Charles.  Right?

 

2-00:15:53

Brudno:

Uh-huh.

 

2-00:15:54

Schwarz:

We stayed at this motel in Capeville for four days.  And we decided we liked that sort of place, and so we got a real estate agent.  Hungars Beach Road is one of the places they he brought us.  I still remember the salesman’s name – Jack Mason.  I don’t know if he’s still alive. We bought a lot- built a house on it in the 1972 and I still live here.

 

2-00:16:36

Brudno:

If you don’t mind me asking about your – about your work at the Hotel Pennsylvania, how did you spend your recreational time?

 

2-00:16:51

Schwarz:

What time?

 

2-00:16:56

Brudno:

Your recreational time, when you were not at work – while you were working at –?

 

2-00:17:00

Schwarz:

When I worked, how did I spend my –?

 

2-00:17:03

Brudno:

Your recreational time – your free time.

 

2-00:17:06

Schwarz:

I didn’t have an awful lot of free time. Because this costume jewelry kept me buying supplies and selling them to the other operators. Besides,

 

2-00:17:21

Brudno:

Hmm.  If you don’t mind if we talk about your marriage with Al – when did you and Al marry?

 

2-00:17:40

Schwarz:

Like I said, he was – I came to the hotel to start working in the 1930s.  And I met Albert at this dance they gave for the employees.  We went together to movies and different things.  Then we got engaged, and he took me to Maspeth to meet his parents.

 

2-00:18:30

Brudno:

Where did you – where were you and Al married?  May I ask?

 

2-00:18:40

Schwarz:

Where were we married?

 

2-00:18:42

Brudno:

Yes.

 

2-00:18:43

Schwarz:

We were married in Maspeth at a Lutheran church.

 

2-00:18:46

Brudno:

But you didn’t know what – do you remember the date that you were married?

 

 

2-00:18:53

Schwarz:

Sometime in April I think. Like I said, the war had already started.  Albert and I had a four-day honeymoon in Bear Mountain.  And then I saw him off on the train.  And he was running to catch the train at the last minute.

 

And I was just so choked up, I called his brother right afterwards, and I couldn’t talk.  Because I was up to here.  You know?

 

2-00:19:39

Brudno:

Uh-huh.  What was the marriage date?  What was the marriage date?

 

2-00:19:47

Schwarz:

What was the marriage like?

 

2-00:19:54

Brudno:

Yes.  What was the – the date – what was the marriage date?

 

2-00:20:00

Schwarz:

I’m just trying to think now.  In the 1930s – I meant to look that up before you came here, and I forgot it.

 

2-00:20:21

Brudno:

That’s alright.  Did the fact that the United States was at war influence your decision to get married?  [Schwarz: Intelligible] Brudno: Did the fact that the United States was at war influence your decision to get married?

 

2-00:20:40

Schwarz:

We wanted to get married, so we did, and spent that four days in Bear Mountain.  And then we were back in New York, and he was running to catch that train.

 

2-00:21:04

Brudno:

And, of course – was the timing of the wedding influenced by the war?

 

2-00:21:20

Schwarz:

The what?

 

2-00:21:22

Brudno:

Was the timing of the wedding influenced by the war?

 

2-00:21:25

Schwarz:

Was –?

 

2-00:21:28

Brudno:

The timing of the wedding.

 

2-00:21:31

Schwarz:

The time of the wedding?

 

 

 

2-00:21:32

Brudno:

Yes.  The timing of the wedding influenced by the war?

 

2-00:21:37

Schwarz:

Well, we had been thinking about it for quite a while, I guess.

 

2-00:21:41

Brudno:

What was the wedding like?

 

2-00:21:52

Schwarz:

Well, it was very small – my husband’s brothers and sisters, my one sister.  And we were just married by the minister.  I still remember his name.  Reverend Bosch.  B-O-S-C-H.

 

2-00:22:29

Brudno:

Okay.  You mentioned earlier that you had a four-day honeymoon?

 

2-00:22:41

Schwarz:

Yeah.  We had a four-day honeymoon in Bear Mountain.

 

2-00:22:54

Brudno:

And you said –

 

2-00:22:57

Schwarz:

And then we came back, and then it was time to say goodbye, and he was gone.

 

2-00:23:07

Brudno:

Yeah.

 

2-00:23:10

Schwarz:

But we corresponded all during the war.  Like I said, this was before we were apart.  But I started tracing my writing.  And in some places, you’ll – and I believe there’s the date in here when – when the date – when the war ended.

 

2-00:23:45

Brudno:

Uh-huh.  Do you mind if I go back a little bit to like – to when the United States entered World War II?  What were you doing when the Japanese attacked Pearl Harbor?

 

 

 

2-00:24:09

Schwarz:

What was I doing when –?

 

2-00:24:12

Brudno:

The Japanese attacked Pearl Harbor.

 

2-00:24:14

Schwarz:

Still didn’t get it.

 

2-00:24:17

Brudno:

What were you doing when the Japanese attacked Pearl Harbor?

 

2-00:24:22

Schwarz:

When –?

 

2-00:24:25

Brudno:

When the Japanese –

 

2-00:24:26

Schwarz:

When the Japanese attacked Pearl Harbor?  Because the war started right after that seriously.

 

2-00:24:38

Brudno:

Do you remember what you were doing when the Japanese –?

 

2-00:24:44

Schwarz:

What was I doing? [Pause] I’d only be guessing now, if I –

 

2-00:25:00

Brudno:

I see.  Of course, after Pearl Harbor was attacked, was hotel business changed – when the nation entered the war?  Was the business of the Hotel Pennsylvania changed when the nation entered the war?

 

2-00:25:28

Schwarz:

Was the hotel famous at that –?

 

2-00:25:31

Brudno:

No.  No.  Hotel business.

 

2-00:25:33

Schwarz:

Oh, hotel business?

 

2-00:25:34

Brudno:

Changed when the nation entered the war?

 

2-00:25:37

Schwarz:

Hmm.  I can’t remember that it did change.

 

2-00:25:50

Brudno:

How did – how did – where did you live during the war?

 

2-00:26:01

Schwarz:

Where did I live during the war?  I lived in Whitestone, Queens for part of the time.  I lived with someone who’s husband did all the cooking, who didn’t seem to do much other than cooking.  But, anyway, we got our meals.

 

Because he did all – he was good at the cooking, so we got all of our meals there, in her apartment.  I think it was more than an apartment.  It was a house – one of those brownstone places.

 

2-00:27:12

Brudno:

Besides Whitestone, Queens, any other – what was the other place?

 

2-00:27:27

Schwarz:

Then I –

 

2-00:27:29

Brudno:

During the war, I mean.

 

2-00:27:31

Schwarz:

Then I moved to a small apartment in New York.

 

2-00:27:36

Brudno:

In Manhattan?

 

2-00:27:41

Schwarz:

I beg your pardon?

 

 

 

 

2-00:27:42

Brudno:

You mean in Manhattan?  You said in New York.  Where in New York?  Forgive me.  You mean in Manhattan?

 

2-00:27:53

Schwarz:

Oh, in Manhattan?  Yes.  Then I could walk to work.

 

2-00:28:00

Brudno:

Were you affected by the rationing and the shortages during the war?

 

2-00:28:09

Schwarz:

Yes, there was rationing.  I remember I was lucky to be able to buy margarine with this little yellow thing that colored the butter.  It looked like lard until you squeezed this little ball that colored the – this white stuff.

 

2-00:28:43

Brudno:

What other – did you suffer any other hardships during the war?  Did you face any other hardships during the war?

 

2-00:28:56

Schwarz:

No.  I can’t say that I did.

 

2-00:28:58

Brudno:

What kind of support system did you have while Al was away?  Like family?  Friends? Coworkers?

 

2-00:29:10

Schwarz:

Well, yeah.  Albert had one brother and – let’s see – how many sisters?  There was Mildred, Edith, and Sophia.  Three sisters.  Yeah.

 

2-00:29:34

Brudno:

Uh-huh.  How did Al get into the military?  May I ask?

 

2-00:29:41

Schwarz:

I’m sorry.

 

 

2-00:29:42

Brudno:

How did Al get into the military?

 

2-00:29:44

Schwarz:

How did Al –?

 

2-00:29:45

Brudno:

Yeah.  How Al went into the military.

 

2-00:29:48

Schwarz:

I still didn’t get it.

 

2-00:29:52

Brudno:

How Al went into the military – how he went into the – did he enlist?  Was he drafted?

 

2-00:29:59

Schwarz:

Oh, he was drafted.  Yes.  He was drafted.  And then we spent that four days – we got married.  We had been going together, and we liked each other.  And we eventually knew that we expected to get married.  Because he gave me a ring, which I wore on this hand.  We hadn’t told any of the family yet.

 

So now Albert is deceased, of course.  And I wear that ring and my husband’s ring.  And I sent him his ring while he was in the war.  And you know that ring went around the world and came back to me after he was home.

 

[Laughter]

 

2-00:31:11

Brudno:

And it says, according to your scrapbook, that he was in the Army.

 

2-00:31:25

Schwarz:

I beg your pardon?

 

2-00:31:26

Brudno:

He was in the Army – that Al was in the Army?

 

2-00:31:29

Schwarz:

He was in the Army.  Yes.  I think he had written here someplace.  “So this is the Army.”

 

 

2-00:31:40

Brudno:

When did he join the Army?

 

2-00:31:46

Schwarz:

Well, like I said, he was drafted.

 

2-00:31:54

Brudno:

And –

 

2-00:32:02

Schwarz:

And I said goodbye to him four days later.

 

2-00:32:06

Brudno:

Of course, during the war, there were a lot of women who had never worked before, yet started working in these defense jobs.

 

2-00:32:19

Schwarz:

Oh, what?  You want to know what he did when he came home?

 

2-00:32:23

Brudno:

Well, actually, I’m asking – why did you continue to be an operator at the hotel?  Why did you continue to be an operator at the hotel, when defense jobs were available – when there were many defense jobs available?

 

2-00:32:45

Schwarz:

You want to know what he did?

 

2-00:32:50

Brudno:

No.  No.  I mean why did you continue as an operator at the hotel, when many defense jobs became available to women such as yourself? [Pause] Did you consider working in a defense job?

 

2-00:33:19

Schwarz:

Did we work in the –?

 

2-00:33:21

Brudno:

Did you consider working in a defense job?

 

 

2-00:33:24

Schwarz:

In what job?

 

2-00:33:26

Brudno:

In a defense job.  Did you consider working in these temporary defense jobs – defense factory jobs?

 

2-00:33:44

Schwarz:

Did he consider?

 

2-00:33:46

Brudno:

Did you?  Did you consider?

 

2-00:33:47

Schwarz:

Oh.  Did I consider what?

 

2-00:33:49

Brudno:

Did you consider working in a defense job during the war?  Defense job?  Did you consider working in a defense job?

 

2-00:34:03

Schwarz:

What kind of a job?

 

2-00:34:03

Brudno:

Defense job. Defense.

 

2-00:34:04

Schwarz:

Defense?

 

2-00:34:05

Brudno:

Yeah.  Job in the defense industry.

 

2-00:34:10

Schwarz:

No.  I worked at the hotel the whole time.

 

2-00:34:14

Brudno:

Why did you continue working at the hotel during the war?

 

 

2-00:34:19

Schwarz:

Why? [Pause] I liked the work.

 

2-00:34:23

Brudno:

May I ask?  Did you have any children with Al during the war years?  Or?

 

2-00:34:35

Schwarz:

Did we have any children?

 

2-00:34:36

Brudno:

Yes.  During the war.

 

2-00:34:38

Schwarz:

I have a son from a previous marriage.  He lives out on Long Island.

 

2-00:34:45

Brudno:

Uh-huh.  You said before you met Al, you were married with somebody else.

 

2-00:34:53

Schwarz:

Well, yes. [Pause] And that marriage didn’t last very long.

 

2-00:35:02

Brudno:

So who was her first husband?  Who did you marry first?

 

2-00:35:16

Schwarz:

His name is Philip Warner.

 

2-00:35:22

Brudno:

What did Philip Warner do for a living?

 

2-00:35:28

Schwarz:

He worked at Brookhaven National Laboratories – a physicist.

 

2-00:35:38

Brudno:

Oh. [Pause]  Oh.  So the marriage didn’t last long?  Did it last like a few years?

 

 

 

2-00:35:54

Schwarz:

Uhm.

 

2-00:35:55

Brudno:

Your first marriage?

 

2-00:35:56

Schwarz:

Well, he retired.  He worked as a physicist at Brookhaven National Laboratory, which still exists.  It’s quite famous. [Pause]

 

2-00:36:13

Brudno: [unintelligible]

 

2-00:36:23

Schwarz:

He was planning on retiring.  And when they offered him additional years pay to retire early, he took that opportunity.  Because he was gonna retire anyway.

 

And then part of the deal was that he would still solve problems and keep in touch with them.  And he still visits there every – every few weeks.

 

2-00:37:08

Brudno:

Tell me about your son – how you raised your son during the war.

 

2-00:37:20

[Interview Interruption while batteries are changed.]

 

3-00:00:01

Brudno:

We’re still – yeah.  Before I interrupt you, I think we were talking about your son from a previous marriage.

 

3-00:00:10

Schwarz:

Beg your pardon.

 

3-00:00:11

Brudno:

You were talking about your son from a previous marriage.

 

3-00:00:14

Schwarz:

My son?

 

 

 

3-00:00:17

Brudno:

Yes.  From a previous marriage.

 

3-00:00:20

Schwarz:

Yes.

 

3-00:00:21

Brudno:

Phillip?

 

3-00:00:22

Schwarz:

His name is Warner, last name.

 

3-00:00:28

Brudno:

Yes.  And that your son went to school in Good Ground.

 

3-00:00:38

Schwarz:

In Good Ground, yes.

 

3-00:00:41

Brudno:

All right.  And how did you and Al stay in contact during the war?

 

3-00:00:59

Schwarz:

How did we stay in contact?

 

3-00:01:01

Brudno:

Yeah.  You mentioned earlier that – I assume you had contact with Al.

 

3-00:01:07

Schwarz:

I had contact with him through letters.

 

3-00:01:11

Brudno:

How often do you write letters to Al?

 

3-00:01:15

Schwarz:

Every week.

 

3-00:01:18

Brudno:

And how often does he send you a letter?

 

3-00:01:25

Schwarz:

And he wrote back two every week.  Like I said, you’ll read all of this later.

 

3-00:01:38

Brudno:

And how did the contact impact you?

 

3-00:01:43

Schwarz:

How did –

 

3-00:01:44

Brudno:

How did the contact impact you?

 

3-00:01:46

Schwarz:

How did –

 

3-00:01:47

Brudno:

How did the communication between you and Al impacted you?  You said it’s once a week.  How did it impact you on – impact you?

 

3-00:01:59

Schwarz:

I’m sorry.  I still didn’t get that last part.

 

3-00:02:01

Brudno:

How did the contact impact you?

 

3-00:02:04

Schwarz:

How did –

 

3-00:02:06

Brudno:

How did the communication impacted the marriage?

 

3-00:02:12

Schwarz:

How did he feel about that?

 

3-00:02:15

Brudno:

I mean how did the contact between you and Al impacted the marriage?

 

 

3-00:02:23

Schwarz:

Oh.  That first marriage ended before I started going with Al.

 

3-00:02:32

Brudno:

I mean the contact with Al, I mean, impacted your marriage.  How did the letter sending impacted your marriage with Al?

 

3-00:02:45

Schwarz:

How did it impact –

 

3-00:02:49

Brudno:

Yeah.  The marriage with Al, the letter sending, the communication.  [Pause] How did the contact – [Pause] let’s move on to the next question.  [Intelligible] this is maybe a little bit [Pause] – so let’s talk about the end of the war.

 

3-00:03:24

Schwarz:

The end of the war.

 

3-00:03:26

Brudno:

Yeah.  How did you learn that the war was over?

 

3-00:03:29

Schwarz:

I was working in the hotel when the war ended.  In fact, I was on the all-night shift, and so I’m at the switchboard all by myself and trying to keep up with – answer everybody’s call.  I’d called the chief operator, who was home in bed, and I told her – oh, before I called her, one of the guests at the hotel that I talked to, he asked me what was all the noise down on the street.  I said, “I don’t know what the noise is.  I’m alone on the switchboard, and I have no idea.  I hear all that noise myself.”

A lot of people was yelling and talking, and I couldn’t make out what anybody said.  But anyway, I connected this man with the lobby, and somebody there might have told him.  Buy anyway, before that, he decided he was going to get up and get dressed and go down there and find out what’s going on and come back and tell me.  He came back and, like he said, he called me.  He said, “The war is over.”  That’s how I found out the war was over.  And by then, Albert was in Japan.  Japan had surrendered.

 

3-00:05:34

Brudno:

Was he on a ship off the coast of Japan at the time it surrendered?

 

 

 

 

3-00:05:47

Schwarz:

Albert’s position in the war was to operate a tank, and so I always felt in my heart he couldn’t have been assigned a better thing during the war because he’s alive.  He’s comin’ home.

 

3-00:06:05

Brudno:

All right.  And you mentioned earlier that you tried to contact your chief operator during the night shift when –

 

3-00:06:17

Schwarz:

I had called the chief operator to tell her that I couldn’t control the board because it was so busy with all these people wanting to know what was all this noise on the street.  And so that one man got up, got dressed, went over there and found out, and then he came back and said the war was over.

 

3-00:06:47

Brudno:

Oh.  And now that the war is over, when did you and Al were reunited?

 

3-00:06:59

Schwarz:

When did he come home?

 

3-00:07:05

Brudno:

Or just tell me about how you guys were reunited, how you two were reunited.

 

3-00:07:14

Schwarz:

Well, when he came home, we lived in this little apartment which was in walking distance to the hotel.  And so both the hotel and somebody else – oh, and [Pause] the place where he worked before.

 

3-00:07:54

Brudno:

The New York Transit Authority?

 

3-00:07:57

Schwarz:

Just trying to think of the name of the place ‘cause I still get his pension.

 

3-00:08:10

Brudno:

Was it the New York Transit Authority?

 

 

3-00:08:19

Schwarz:

The New York Transit Authority.  You’re right.

 

3-00:08:22

Brudno:

How did you two were reunited?

 

3-00:08:26

Schwarz:

I beg your pardon.

 

3-00:08:28

Brudno:

How did you two were reunited after the war?

 

3-00:08:32

Schwarz:

After the war, how were we –

 

3-00:08:34

Brudno:

Reunited.

 

3-00:08:36

Schwarz:

Oh.  Well, he just came to – he had the address, of course, from all the letters and then just came right to the apartment.  And then we spent the four days in Bear Mountain, and when we came home, we went to Maspeth to visit with his parents and his sister.

 

3-00:09:07

Brudno:

So you went to –

 

3-00:09:10

Schwarz:

And so he didn’t accept the job offered him at the hotel.  Instead he wanted to go back to the Transit Authority, and I’m kinda glad that he did because I now get his pension.  I had a pension of my own, but I decided it was better for me to take my pension from New York Transit Authority, which I did.

 

3-00:09:52

Brudno:

And so you said after you and Al were reunited you went back to Bear Mountain as if you were trying to resume your honeymoon.

 

3-00:10:07

Schwarz:

After he came back home, no, we didn’t go back to Bear Mountain.  It was too busy spending time with friends and his parents.

 

3-00:10:30

Brudno:

So what was life like when Al returned home though?

 

3-00:10:49

Schwarz:

What was it like?

3-00:10:51

Brudno:

For Al when he returned home.

 

3-00:10:53

Schwarz:

[Pause] Like I said, we just went – we visited and spent a lot of time with his family.  And I still had family then.

 

3-00:11:19

Brudno:

And did you continue to work at the Hotel Pennsylvania after the war?

 

3-00:11:28

Schwarz:

Did what?

 

3-00:11:29

Brudno:

Did you continue to work at Hotel Pennsylvania after the war?

 

3-00:11:32

Schwarz:

Did Albert?

 

3-00:11:34

Brudno:

I mean did you work at –

 

3-00:11:36

Schwarz:

Oh, me.  Yes, I continued working mostly at night.  Nobody else wanted what they call the graveyard shift, and so I would offer to take that so that I could have Christmas off to go home.

 

3-00:12:06

Brudno:

Did getting married and having children or having a child change your views on work?

 

3-00:12:21

Schwarz:

Did we –

 

3-00:12:23

Brudno:

Did getting married and having a child change your opinions about work?  Like getting married and having children change your opinions about working?

 

3-00:12:42

Schwarz:

Well, it was like I said, Albert and I never had any children.

 

3-00:12:55

Brudno:

Oh.

 

3-00:12:57

Schwarz:

[Pause] We would have been happy to, but apparently it just didn’t happen.

 

3-00:13:07

Brudno:

So it’s just your son from a previous marriage?

 

3-00:13:10

Schwarz:

Yes.  And part of the time after he came home, we went to visit my sister that I used to live with in Hampton Bays.  And Phillip met him for the first time.  When I say Phillip, I’m talking about my son.

 

3-00:13:45

Brudno:

Your son?

 

3-00:13:46

Schwarz:

Had met him.  He just looked and looked at Albert and he says, “You’re going to be my new daddy.”  [Laughs]

 

3-00:13:56

Brudno:

Was Al discharged from the Army at the end of the war?  Right after?

 

3-00:14:11

Schwarz:

Yeah.  When he was discharged, he went back to the New York Transit Authority.

 

3-00:14:17

Brudno:

And did Al learn any skills from the military that prepared him to return to civilian work?

 

 

3-00:14:29

Schwarz:

Like I said, he operated a tank, and he always wanted to work for the Transit Authority.  I’m just trying to think what his title was there.

 

3-00:14:48

Brudno:

But it was a much higher position in the New York Transit Authority than it was before the war?  Was his pay better than it was before the war?

 

3-00:15:11

Schwarz:

He went right back to working –

 

3-00:15:13

Brudno:

Or did he work the same job?

 

3-00:15:18

Schwarz:

– as he was.  He was a supervisor.

 

3-00:15:20

Brudno:

All right.  And how, in the post-war world, did Al feel about you continuing to work?

 

3-00:15:34

Schwarz:

How do what?

 

3-00:15:35

Brudno:

After the war ended, how did Al feel about you continuing to work?

 

3-00:15:40

Schwarz:

About my continuing to work?

 

3-00:15:43

Brudno:

Yeah.  How did Al feel about you still working?

 

 

3-00:15:46

Schwarz:

He never questioned it, and I liked to work even though – at that time $0.37 an hour wasn’t too bad, and I used to work a lot of overtime.

 

3-00:16:05

Brudno:

How long were you and Al married?

 

3-00:16:29

Schwarz:

How long?  Fifty-seven years.

 

3-00:16:31

Brudno:

Fifty-seven years.  And do you think beginning your marriage during the war had any impact on your marriage?

 

3-00:16:45

Schwarz:

Well, like I said, we had always planned to get married, but when we knew he was going to be drafted, we, of course, pushed the marriage up a little bit.

 

3-00:17:06

Brudno:

And I have just one more question.  How so?  How so?

 

3-00:17:12

Schwarz:

Huh?

 

3-00:17:13

Brudno:

I have one more question.  How so?  This is an additional question to the question I already said about – so you said that even though you were going to getting around to marrying and questioning it, and somehow you married during the war, but how so?  That’s my – Yes.  Well, actually, this is really – you managed to answer all my questions.

 

3-00:18:02

Schwarz:

Hmm?

 

3-00:18:03

Brudno:

You managed to finish all my questions, and I thank you for letting me interview you for the duration.  I’m sorry that your hearing aids are not working well.

 

3-00:18:19

Schwarz:

Yes.  They’re –

 

3-00:18:22

[End of Audio]

 

 

 

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